keywords

Psilomethoxin, psychedelics, mental health, veterans, community drug development, healing, psilocybin, DMT, psychedelic industry, patents

hashtags

#psilomethoxin
#sacredsynthesis
#toadshrooms
#bufoboomers
#churchofpsilomethoxin
#toadally
#hikrodosing
#psilotoad
#toadstool
#🐸🍄

summary

In this conversation, Gabe, Ben Ian and Ryan discuss their experiences with Psilomethoxin, a psychedelic compound derived from mushrooms. They reminisce about their first Psilomethoxin dieta experience, compare Psilomethoxin to psilocybin, and explore its potential as a healing tool, especially for veterans. The discussion also touches on the future of the psychedelic industry, community drug development, and the implications of patents related to Psilomethoxin.

takeaways

• Psilomethoxin offers a unique experience compared to traditional psychedelics.
• The healing process can be simplified for better accessibility.
• Psilomethoxin can serve as both an on-ramp and off-ramp for other psychedelics.
• Community drug development is essential for faster access to healing substances.
• Veterans are finding relief through the use of Psilomethoxin.
• The psychedelic industry is evolving with new compounds and accessibility.
• Patents on psychedelics can complicate access and development.
• Natural mushrooms should be accessible to everyone.
• The consumer will benefit from more quality products at lower prices.
• Healing doesn’t have to be a painful process.

Sound Bites

• “This is some Jedi magic.”
• “Healing doesn’t have to hurt.”
• “Psilomethoxin is also a wonderful on-ramp.”

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Setting the Stage

01:14 First Dieta Experience with Psilomethoxin

03:00 Ryan’s Background and Journey into Psychedelics

06:46 Comparing Psilomethoxin and Psilocybin

10:48 The Potential of Isolated Psilomethoxin

12:10 Exploring the Afterglow of Psilomethoxin

17:14 Veterans and the Use of Psilomethoxin

24:41 Community Drug Development and Accessibility

30:49 The Future of the Psychedelic Industry

35:45 Closing Thoughts and Reflections

Transcript

Psilo Toad (00:01.244)
What do y’all wanna talk about today?

Psilo Toad (00:01.368)
Get plugged in.

Check this out. This is I want to talk about. Look at this fucking samurai sword. Torch. I just fucking got, Look at this thing. It’s made by Yocan I’m up in the head shop and I see this. I’m like, if it’s under a hundred bucks, I’m going to buy it. It’s 55 bucks. Give me a fan. Torch. This is some Jedi magic.

Psilo Toad (00:15.568)
like that.

Psilo Toad (00:20.57)
like a good torch man, I love a good torch.

Psilo Toad (00:34.113)
There we go.

Ryan (00:37.878)
I got about until like 2.40 or 1.45 your time, 2.45 my time. Just to give you a heads up, like you don’t have to stop, but I personally need to like check out.

Psilo Toad (00:43.915)
Okay, we’ll just go till then.

Psilo Toad (00:53.7)
Okay, that, what time is it for you right now, man? Is it what?

Ryan (00:57.447)
It is 245. Wait, no, it’s two something. What is it? Hold on. Yes, two delivery.

Psilo Toad (01:04.668)
223.

Psilo Toad (01:07.254)
So how long do you have, how much time do you have from now, Ryan?

Ryan (01:11.384)
So like 22 minutes.

Psilo Toad (01:11.502)
about 20 minutes.

Psilo Toad (01:15.023)
sweet. Okay, yeah. want to talk about our first Dieta with Psilomethoxin like when you and Kaila came down? that’d be awesome, dude. I’d love to kind of reminisce on that story. It was really a good mind-blowing experience.

Ryan (01:22.328)
Sure. Yeah, absolutely.

Psilo Toad (01:26.448)
Yeah.

Psilo Toad (01:33.244)
Yeah, if you could just give the audience a quick introduction to yourself, Ryan.

Psilo Toad (01:37.228)
Yeah, yeah, why don’t you, Gabe, why don’t we just pretend, you know, I can even hit record and turn it back off. And I was, can, let’s have a new edit point and just start. I know we started recording this time. Yeah, we’re just recording. We can slice it on that. All you do is drag the slider. So what I’m just saying is, yeah, so I’m just giving you, Gabe, context of the background. I gave Ashley, who’s already growing mushrooms for me,

Psilo Toad (01:47.622)
That’s what.

Psilo Toad (02:05.707)
five meo dmt holy salt say hey can you put this in the mushrooms next time you’re growing it whatever appropriate flush she did that I got those mushrooms that was September of 2021 and I took them no and you know no negative effect and I was like I took more that’s second day and I took more I shared it with Ben and then

I think Ryan was coming down the next day. next day, yeah, exactly. The next day or day after, were like, man, Ryan was down there with his lady. So by that third day, we kept on increasing our dose. So by the time Ryan got there, then we just started taking it multiple times through the day and took it through the weekend. So I’ll let Ryan go from there. So you had some context, kid.

Psilo Toad (02:55.622)
Gotcha. Gotcha.

Psilo Toad (03:00.177)
Yeah, Ryan, if you could just kind of give the audience an introduction to yourself, who you are, your affiliation with the church, and then maybe describe this Dieta experience.

Ryan (03:10.326)
Perfect. So yeah, my name is Ryan Begin I live in Jackman, Maine. I met Ian at an Americans for Safe Access conference in 2015, along with our friend, Amy Rising. And then, you know, I was at the end of my cannabis run. you know, Ian picked up the flag and he kept running with it into, you know, psychedelic land. And eventually I caught up with him and Ben.

in 2019 we went to Mexico, we did Bufo for my first time and opened up a healing portal. So pretty much from there we’ve all been on our own little individual paths while working towards the same goal. yeah, Ian fell across this magical recipe and

invited my girlfriend at the time down and we were prepared, like my girlfriend and I prepared ourselves to do ayahuasca. So we were super clean diet, we’d tobacco purged ourselves. So our palates were extremely clean, like extremely ready to receive any whatever medicine was coming our way. So we were well prepared. But yeah, I mean, we just

Ian and Ben picked us up and then from there it was just Psilomethoxin and you know, just, we just tried to see what it would do, you know, where is it going to take us? And I mean.

The first time I took it, knew that it was, I’ve never done anything like this. Like it’s instantly. mean, I remember, I think we’re in, we’re in one of the stores down there, grocery stores down there. And I remember looking at Ian, I’m like, what else do you need? I’m like, what, you know, what else do you need? Like this, this seems to, you know, touch everything. You know, all the, you know, for me, it just, it, it felt like I was floating in an ocean. Like I I wasn’t.

Ryan (05:19.757)
I wasn’t floating in the ocean. was like part of the ocean. Like, you know, I was the ocean and it was like, it was just a groovy feeling. And I remember we went, we went to a meet up with some, with some people and we’re, we’re at a pretty high dose of Psilomethoxin. Our receptors were pretty flooded at that point. And I just remember sitting there and usually like, I don’t like to sit in that type of setting. And usually I’m just like, you know, I got to get out of here.

But then it was like, you know, I found myself like, you know, I had to pee, but I was still sitting there for like another half hour because I didn’t want to miss the conversation. I didn’t want to miss, you know, the interaction. I was, magnetized to the energy around me. And instead of, you know, wanting to, you know, not necessarily run from it, but just, you know, take a break from it. I was finding myself wanting to be more involved with it and really

And not just involved on the emotional or whatever level, but actually physically involved with it too. Whether it was noticing a piece of trash on the ground, and you’d be like, wow. And you’re picking it up and throwing it in the trash, just way more conscious of my environment and of the effect that I have on my environment.

Psilo Toad (06:46.138)
Awesome, awesome. How would you say that it compares for you to something like psilocybin?

Ryan (06:57.361)
For me personally, the reason why I love Psilomethoxin is because with Psilomethoxin, A, you don’t have to do any regimen. It’s an actual take as needed type of medicine. B,

There’s no real commitment. know, there’s not like when you take mushrooms, you’re like, okay, if I take a little more or a little less, it’s going to affect me differently with and in with mushrooms, you know, you get the stomach, you get, get, you know, with mushrooms, you’re, you’re, know, you’re, you’re asking to go more on a learning journey. I think with Psilomethoxin you become the learning journey and

You know, you’re part of it instead of being separated from it. It’s got that unifying energy where Where you you know, you don’t have to do anything out of the ordinary within your normal daily Dave daily behaviors and it you can just plug Psilomethoxin in you can take it in the morning You can take it before you eat breakfast. You take it after you eat breakfast, know, you can drive your car you think before work It’s not gonna take you

Psilo Toad (08:12.516)
you

Ryan (08:14.115)
out of your cognitive behavioral ranges, it’s gonna keep you in there. Whereas psilocybin mushrooms, if you take a little more, you could be committed for a long trip. With the Psilomethoxin like I said, it doesn’t affect your eating, your sleeping. You can take it right before bed and have some nice lucid type dreaming. So you can plug it into wherever it fits with your schedule.

as opposed to having to take it in the morning like psilocybin, LSD for instance, you want to take that earlier in the day or else you’re not gonna be able to sleep. Well, this is a psychedelic, it’s gonna give you that same opening up, opening different perspectives, but it’s also gonna allow you to stay within your daily behaviors. I think a lot of these medicines, it’s…

It’s such a change to your daily behaviors and you have to do so much preparation and you have to do all this work, change your diet, change this, change that to do the medicine. And I think those medicines are great. I think those medicines have a purpose. But I think the need is so great and there’s so many veterans killing themselves, so many people killing themselves, so many people with mental health issues.

Psilo Toad (09:21.965)
you

Ryan (09:33.186)
And so many people just being led to the fire with all these SSRIs that, you know, this is the option. can slide this right into your daily routine. You don’t need to go to a doctor and it doesn’t need to be tough. You know, I think the more that we learn about healing, the less complicated it becomes. And the less complicated you keep the healing,

I think the truer the healing is, the deeper the healing sticks. think when we complicate stuff, we add barriers between the individual and the healing. So the simpler we can keep this, here, yeah, take this. You don’t need to change anything during your day. You can eat, sleep, do the same exercise routine and everything. But when you take this medicine, you’re…

you’re naturally going to be motivated to be a better human. So it’s not like, you know, these other medicines where you need to make the change prior to the medicine. This is a medicine you take prior to the change. It’s going to motivate, influence the change.

Psilo Toad (10:48.488)
yeah, I think that was an interesting perception, insight to Psilomethoxin there. A lot of people have described it man as feeling sort of like an extended state sort of 5-MeO DMT afterglow type of feeling. Have you experienced that as well?

Ryan (11:10.122)
absolutely. You know, you get the smile you get, you know, you get just when you just get just above sub perceptual, you get that, you know, get that smile and you get that white feeling, you get that, you know, unity every, know, we’re all one, the law of one. I think you’ll get that in it. You know, that’s just like after you smoke a big dose, but again, not everyone has has the ability to smoke five meo on a deep dive with five meo

So this, you know, softens the blow to I think, you know, healing doesn’t have to hurt. And that’s the biggest lesson. You healing doesn’t have to hurt, you know, for years we’ve been trying to hurt ourselves and like, I’m gonna take a heroic dose. And it’s like this big battle. doesn’t have to be a battle, you know, healing should be symbiotic with whatever medicine you’re using. And I think this is the most symbiotic medicine with our human behaviors that I have found.

Psilo Toad (12:10.352)
Gotcha. Gotcha. Let me ask you this man. So, you know, as you know, one of the things that we would like to do is bring the isolated Psilomethoxin compound to market, right? Where people can get that very affordably, very excessively, the isolated compound as it stands right now, the current sacrament that we offer is sort of the toad shrooms, the shrooms, the, the mushrooms that have four hydroxylated had been fed the five MEO DMT, right? So within the sacrament

There is some residual amounts of the psilocybin, psilocin, other alkaloids found within psilocybin mushrooms on top of the proposed psilomethoxin. That’s the sacrament. Based on your experiences with psilocybin, and guess Ian and Ben, I would like to hear this from you guys as well too, but Ryan, you can go first since I know you’ve got to leave here soon. But based on your experiences with psilocybin and both the sacrament,

Psilo Toad (13:07.268)
.

Psilo Toad (13:10.142)
do you think the, if you had to guess, take an educated guess, guess I should say, what do think the isolated Psilomethoxin compound experience is going to feel like?

Ryan (13:22.142)
I think some of the earlier versions of Psilomethoxin may have contained more psilocybin until the recipe got worked out. So I think, know, at first, because I’d always get the yawns, like when I take psilocybin, I’d always get the yawns. that’s when I know it’s hitting me. And I think some of the earlier versions of our Psilomethoxin recipe, there was a little bit of psilocybin in them because I remember getting the yawns. But I think, you know, the

Psilo Toad (13:40.278)
Thank

Ryan (13:52.028)
recent, you know, mixture, whatever I think is more, you know, upbeat. And I don’t see any similarities to psilocybin. I don’t feel, you know, the psilocybin effects. I don’t feel any of it at this point. I mean, it still exists in there, but I think there’s such a sub perceptual level that it has no no effect on me personally.

Psilo Toad (14:20.454)
What do you think the isolated Psilomethoxin compound is going to feel like whenever that is brought to market?

Ryan (14:27.186)
I’m not sure. So for me, you know, I’m looking at it, you know, in in when we grow it in the toadstool, you know, there’s sort of an entourage effect. So there’s different other things that are happening, you know, different, you know, reactions that are happening that we can’t account for, I think. you know, with the ice, when you’re isolating it, then you’re getting pure. That’s like if you take taking THC out of, you know, cannabis, you know, you’re going to get that effect. And it’s

Psilo Toad (14:49.116)
you

Ryan (14:56.333)
probably going to be more exact and a more exaggerated effect. You know, so maybe you have to take less of a dose and you know, you’re not going to feel any of the the psilocybin effects because it’s all it’s not going to exist.

Psilo Toad (15:13.766)
Yeah, yeah, okay. Ian, Ben, what do you guys think?

Psilo Toad (15:17.53)
Yeah, feel, I mean, I feel pretty strongly that it will resemble five meo DMT and. You know, at medium or even higher doses of the mushrooms of the of the toadshrooms the experience feels really like six or eight milligrams of vaporized. Five meo and you know, I also. I.

I made a nasal spray to try to see the experience and it’s very similar. The nasal spray is very similar to the Psilomethoxin like a medium dose. So like one and a half milligrams in a saline solution. It’s, I’m like, okay, this is showing me that there’s something else going on that’s really in the mushrooms. This is there, it’s the same feeling to me.

So yeah, I think that’s gonna be more of that. And people will be able to go as deep as they want. Like if they wanna go and get like a full release, because you can insuffulate 5-in-meo DMT and you get a nice long acting and people use it in suppositories. So there’s a lot of different ways to apply it. And I think the Psilomethoxin may just be another sort of, just like another texture in that realm, if that makes sense. So it’s gonna.

It’s going to be, I’m sure there’ll be some subtle differences that we’ll discover, but essentially it’s four hydroxylated, five meo DMT, so it may have better penetration into blood-brain barrier. We don’t know. More studies are needed. We just figured out psilocybin. But that’s what we’re trying to do. This is what we’re trying to do. That’s the purpose of all this, to discover and understand and learn.

Psilo Toad (17:00.934)
Very cool. Very cool. Ian.

Psilo Toad (17:14.473)
find what’s useful in these medicines.

Psilo Toad (17:20.681)
Yeah, if ever all this true.

Psilo Toad (17:23.898)
Yeah, Ian, what do you think?

Psilo Toad (17:26.239)
Well, we recently met a group of veterans in the United States that they serve BUFO five meo DMT to people, and they’ve been using our sacramental mushrooms, our Psilomethoxin mushrooms, to give people

Psilo Toad (17:57.542)
Hey guys. Guys, I’m sorry to cut you off. I don’t know if you can hear me or not, but it said that your recording just stopped.

Psilo Toad (18:08.625)
I keep it a do not strip program. Sorry, so we got to one of you pass through so Yeah, I’m a star I’m just starting over here with that story so Yeah to get to answer your question we recently met a bunch of veterans that are in North Carolina and They serve a BUFO 5-meo DMT to other veterans and they’ve been using our Psilomethoxin containing sacrament

Psilo Toad (18:15.259)
You might have to… You might have to…

Psilo Toad (18:38.298)
to give to that people a couple hours after the Bufo experience to maintain that afterglow to help provide a smooth off-ramp for the 5MEO experience. that’s what I was looking for, Oro 5MEO. And for sure the mushrooms like Ben said that provide the same experience that we’ve been able to compare it to vaporizing, synthetic.

in the cart or doing the nasal spray and the biggest difference is yeah I’ve taken mushrooms hundreds of times not a thousand and yeah that affects your sensory data that’s very clear so DMT if you eat it it does nothing if you four hydroxylate it that’s what we call psilocin and then it becomes all about the curves the DMT 20 minutes is different from the psilocin curve but it basically

it’s oral DMT. Calling it psilocin is like, yeah, it’s oral DMT. So the same thing, when you four-hydroxylate 5-MeO DMT, then it becomes oral 5-MeO. And I thought there could be some effect in the molecule itself that could be the more psilocybin expressed. But everything we’ve seen to have seen is all in that 5-HT1A. There’s no trip. There’s no…

sensory changes, there’s no auditory changes, there’s no kinesthetic changes. It’s all energetic and it’s like that feeling of stimulation on 5MeO where you’re surrendered into the white light except at this level it’s a drip effect. You’ve got it over hours and instead it’s just microdosing. It’s just smoothing out the curve.

Yeah, we can’t wait for the science. The computers say that it’s a 5-HT1A effect, but we always need to remember if all of your 5-HT1A, any receptors are filled up, like DMT has a thousand times greater affinity for 5-HT2A over 5-HT1A. But if all your 5-HT2A is filled up with DMT, it’ll go fill up your 5-HT1A also, because those are accessible. well, I mean, I also, I’d like to add that,

Psilo Toad (20:59.479)
There’s a compound called 5-MeO-TRYP and it’s like a triple, I don’t know, but it has, this is just in recent publications, discovered it’s just like 5-MeO-DMT has a thousand times greater affinity for the 5HT1A receptor. So it stands to reason, like, think about experientially, like that.

that works on the vagus nerve. That directly agonizes the vagus nerve, which relaxes it. And it’s a five methoxyl group compound. So that may be the link to where the 5-HT1A agonization comes from. that’s why we’re doing more studies, right? But yeah, I think that’s what we’re saying, right? That this experience may be very similar.

And because it’s chilling, it’s working in that specific receptor, which is free collapse which is just relax, know, relax into life, whatever it is, whatever that person is resisting.

Psilo Toad (21:56.668)
Okay.

Psilo Toad (22:05.542)
Very interesting. Ian, do you have any more sort of feedback that you can share with us about what those veterans in that particular group are reporting? Are a lot of them reporting that the Psilomethoxin after the fact, are they reporting that it feels similar to their 5-MeO afterglow? Are they?

Psilo Toad (22:29.963)
It’s creating an off ramp where we all know, 5-Meo is super powerful and super religio-therapeutic, right? And yet that afterglow effect, the lift from the neurogenesis, neuroplasticity, reduction in neuroinflammation, can go on for days, even weeks, months and years. And it can also be

destabilizing going from your natural ego state to complete unity consciousness, know, merged in the divine ocean. And so for people to be able to, in effect, microdose by 5 MEO DMT, which they can do by sipping on a cart you know, a pen or something like that, but in this oral form, it just, yeah, smooths their off ramp. So does that mean reactivations are going to be less or more? I don’t know.

It’s just helping people to smoothly come up on ramp. That’s all the energy of the preparation, right? The diet getting people ready to be integrated and they do the experience and then Yeah, this is getting them on it right away is a form of micro dosing after the experience to Smooth out the tail. So yeah, but this is all kind of stuff we want to do in the way of you know

clinical trials, observational testing to get feedback from the people because yeah, if we’re get any drugs to help veterans, 55 new drugs a year is not gonna be able to do it. It goes to get through the FDA.

Psilo Toad (24:12.132)
Yeah, one thing that we’ve talked about a lot so far during this series is sort of the differences between these 5-HT1A compounds and the ones, some of the classic serotonergic psychedelics that more heavily target the 5-HT2A, the differences experientially, therapeutically. But have you guys considered what the unique sort of

Ryan (24:31.293)
Okay.

Psilo Toad (24:41.326)
Experiential effects and possible therapeutic outcomes are of combining, say, Psilomethoxin with another psychedelic compound that more heavily targets the 2A. Essentially, the combination of trying to hit 1A heavily and 2A heavily at the same time. Experientially, do you guys find anything special in that and or therapeutically?

Psilo Toad (25:05.575)
No, think that’s what these mushrooms are. At the end of the day, that’s what we’ve done. If think about natural versus synthetic, we’ve divided and split the thing enough to try and find something small inside, a molecule. And so now we can put it back together. I think that’s the truth. We need natural mushrooms to be accessible in places. And then this is like, it’s a non-issue.

have access to these compounds and it’s protected. like states like Colorado or Oregon, some places in California, other places like, yeah, this is 100 % legit in those places. And so maybe that’s the solution in a lot of ways where it comes to practitioners offering these compounds in settings. have these programs in these places. I think that may be the future of all this, all over the country. States are going to

continue to sort of expand that access. And so in that light, like that’s why we’re continuing on this way. This is something that all the people should and will have access to.

Psilo Toad (26:19.514)
Awesome, awesome. Hey Ryan, do you have to go man or do you have time for one more question?

Ryan (26:25.003)
I can do one more question.

Psilo Toad (26:27.388)
Okay, okay, yeah. Same thing here with this one. I’m let Ryan go first, but then I would love to also hear Ben and Ian, your guys’ perspective on this. let’s all think like really big picture right here. Let’s say, know, when we do bring this isolated Psilomethoxin to market, and it’s at scale, you know, and there’s a lot of, it’s very accessible, right?

and also very efficacious, let’s imagine this reality, let’s steer ourselves towards that reality. How does this sort of affect?

Okay, how does this sort of affect the overall psychedelic industry first off? What does this sort of mean for like the end consumer and the sort of products that they’re receiving? And also what does this mean for sort of like the long game that has been played with the legalization of psychedelics overall? Do you think it has an impact on that? Ryan, I’ll just go with you first. How do you think this kind of affects the overall psychedelic industry when this is brought to market?

Ryan (27:32.489)
I think it absolutely rocks the psychedelic industry. I think it absolutely benefits the consumer. The consumer is going to get more quality product for a lower price. You know, I think Big Pharma has driven the prices up and they made it so ridiculous. Like these medicines can be developed like the way we did Psilomethoxin, you Ian tried it himself.

then you try it with friends and then you try it with friends with friends and friends with friends. So you have you gain all this anecdotal evidence and you know all that anecdotal evidence isn’t wrong. Yes it might not be accepted in the scientific community but it’s you know to me it was proof you know seeing thousands of people taking these medicines and not one like bad reaction maybe a few like maybe it didn’t hit me type of reactions but no. So if you can get a

A new breakthrough psychedelic medicine that’s gonna help a bunch of people, you know to marketplace I mean, wow that just busts open a whole bunch of doors, you know, you’re talking break the fucking matrix type shit You know like seriously like you know now now all this money instead of going into research and development and go into actually helping people and doing that healing stuff instead of just providing, you

these SSRIs that cause more trauma, cause more this and that. And I just want to say one thing earlier when we were talking about, know, Psilomethoxin being an off-ramp, Psilomethoxin is also a wonderful on-ramp. Like, usually like an hour before we, you know, we serve bufo, we, we kind of, you know, give the person some Psilomethoxin you know, that way they’re merging into 5-Me-O land instead of, you know, herky jerky. You know, they’re already

they’re already in that space before they get the big blast. So for me, you know, that was one important thing that, you know, we found with it. was, yeah, it’s a great off ramp, but it’s also makes a wonderful on ramp, you know.

Psilo Toad (29:33.35)
That’s…

That’s really interesting. really appreciate that insight because I think this was something I described to Ian and Ben in our last episode was that I have found both psilocybin and Psilomethoxin be extremely effective tools and sort of like what you said on on ramping to the NN just regular NN dimethyltreptamine experience vaporizing that so I can see how Psilomethoxin could be a really useful tool for on ramping to 5-MeO as well. That’s awesome. Very cool.

Thank you, Ryan. Thank you. Do have anything else you want to leave people with where you have to peace out here for the day?

Ryan (30:11.21)
No, I love you, enjoy the experience and the blessing is the anxiety, the blessing is the fear, the blessing is the anger. Be grateful for the blessing. I love you, bye.

Psilo Toad (30:23.938)
Amen, brother, amen. The best shit is on the other side of our comfort zone.

Psilo Toad (30:24.64)
Love you, brother Love you, brother.

Ryan (30:28.553)
Yes, sir.

Psilo Toad (30:31.12)
So.

Psilo Toad (30:35.404)
I think he’s out of here. He’s cool. Like Ryan Yeah, so I guess I’ll just kind of pose that same big picture question to you guys. How do you think that this affects the overall psychedelic industry when this is brought to market?

Psilo Toad (30:49.95)
Well, I think this idea of a psychedelic market, it’s really an industry, it’s just really not true. There’s Christian Agermeyer, he owns most of it, and their whole model is to get things that are already on schedule one, off of schedule one, by proving their medical value, because it says schedule one, no medical value, so they’re trying to get these FDA indications, because once you get an FDA indication for one compound, let’s say, psilocin, then…

Psilocin is no longer schedule one for everybody and then everyone can have it prescribed except that that’s kind of an all or nothing approach and William Leonard Pickard who made 90 % of the world’s LSD if you believe the government, he said there’s going to be 10,000 new triptanines in the next year and a half and

And right now the FDA approves 55 drugs a year, so something that doesn’t work there. And yeah, we’re going to have to do some sort of community drug development to test out these compounds and find out if they’re useful that doesn’t take eight to nine years and cost eight billion dollars and works on rats and all that other stuff.

That doesn’t work because the mental health crisis is too big and specifically veterans 44 day it’s not acceptable

Psilo Toad (32:16.934)
Absolutely, absolutely. Hey, I’ve heard you mention this. You’ve used this term a few times now. Actually, I would say many times. Community drug development. Could you kind of describe to people what exactly you mean by that?

Psilo Toad (32:30.026)
Sure, right now these companies pay people money in clinical trials and it costs a ton of money to do it. Community drug development is something where like it started off in our church to protect ourselves to use the sacrament. We created the church because it was a gift from God to be able to use it. even like Ryan said, we’ve got, know.

tens of thousands of people that have used the medicine, hundreds of thousands of doses. It’s all observational data, it’s still, excuse me, and it still counts for something. And so the Department of Defense has the biggest healthcare system on the planet, the VA. The disbursements for the DOD for VA are huge in the federal budget.

But something’s got to give. So what’s got to give is the VA figuring a way to treat all these veterans that get PTSD more efficaciously. And it’s not waiting for psilocybin mushrooms in 2028, which we already know work. Instead, it’s finding out what these other things, and that’s what’s happening with veterans using CBD or THC in rec state or from hemp or using Delta 8 or using kratom, right?

or using any of these things. And so, yeah, we’ve got to find a better way to get useful things to people and get the medicine to the people. Well, I think the only way is like right to them. so Colorado has rules where it allows practitioners to serve medicine to one another. And if you don’t have a license, you just have to say, don’t have a license. And so if the federal doesn’t look like that, then we’re going to get more harm up.

So in Colorado, I can serve you 5-Meo-MIPT You sure could. And you can serve me 5-Meo-MALT back In Colorado, I can serve you 5-Meo-DMT And then I can serve you 5-Meo-DMT I serve you Psilomethoxin OK. Is it Psilomethoxin or Psilomethoxin? OK. Tomatoes Tomatoes But truthfully, that’s what the law should look like federally. Otherwise, we’re in pharma land.

Psilo Toad (34:38.684)
Yeah

Psilo Toad (34:48.384)
if were in schedule whatever we’re in pharma land because it’s if it’s right now you like good luck good luck going to get if you’re a VA veteran and you’re someone that like uses their care and you know how difficult it is to get mental health care especially if you have to get like community care because they don’t have any doctors VA available which it’s a six-month wait right now minimum to get seen just coming out of service so like yeah let’s let’s make it all to where they have to give

Psilo Toad (34:51.45)
you

Psilo Toad (35:17.816)
They have that you have to be a licensed therapist to do it. Like, okay, so they’re only gonna leave it and still gonna have to wait forever. know, six months is too long in my view. So like there should be no barrier to access that stuff. So yeah, Colorado’s wall is like, let’s do that. That makes a lot of sense.

Psilo Toad (35:36.7)
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It just kind of feels like this all comes back to, know, it’s here, just being held up by nonsense, essentially. And it’s a shame. It’s a damn shame because a lot of people are hurting. So, yeah. You guys, was there anything else in particular you want to talk about today? If anything else, you’d like to leave the audience with?

Psilo Toad (35:45.824)
Yeah. Yeah. yeah.

Psilo Toad (35:58.656)
I don’t know, about, you want comment on that VA thing? The Veteran’s Administration Patent? There was some stuff that popped up, I don’t know if you guys saw, like, Tricycle Day shared something regarding the patent on Psilomethoxin and so, yeah, just like, it’s an important movement, because like, dude, the VA has a patent on Psilomethoxin Like, that’s interesting. Yeah, so it made me, what helped, right, my background is intellectual property and…

You know, studied that stuff in law school and focused on it in the corporate world. their…Psilomethoxin, since it was made in 1965, is in a lot of patents referenced, okay? Over 200,000, there’s over 200,000 references to Psilomethoxin patents because it’s a tryptamine and it was made once. So people, it’s like they’re gonna claim anything in the future as far as possible applications of their unique process, let’s say, to tryptamines, they’re gonna put that in the list. So…

There’s patents right now on Psilomethoxin for our friend, Jared Tudela, for extracting Psilomethoxin and other tryptamines and other psychedelics from certain kinds of solutions. There’s patents on putting Psilomethoxin in a transdermal patch. There’s like the VA patent for using gene therapy to treat PTSD using different psychedelics, right, based on your DNA.

Psilo Toad (37:12.38)
you

Psilo Toad (37:25.11)
your 23andMe or Ancestry.com data. That’s gonna be a marker. You’re gonna be able to do that. As a matter of fact, there’s a company right now, it escapes me the name, but they’ll do that for cannabis. They’ll profile your endocannabinoid system to tell you how you’re gonna possibly react to these things. this patent, the unique part of it that the VA has with the primary…

Mount Sinai VA is for gene therapy. So that’s the unique process that other people don’t have. And then what is the thing that the technology in concert with the medicine is doing? It’s treating PTSD, both treating it and prophylactically preventing it. Okay, so that’s what the patent does. What substance is it used to do that? Any of these potential tryptamines and other psychedelics that have

effect on the human body. So they have this whole laundry list of which Psilomethoxin is one of those things. So when people are talking about axis and all this, government has a patent on Psilomethoxin and other substances to treat and prevent PTSD, especially in veterans. That’s the whole intro, the abstract of the patent, right? It talks all about how PTSD is such a big problem and how veterans have it.

And so what it really does is it makes it easier for the government. If there’s a reason for national security, the government can force a company to make something under the patent rights that otherwise the company would be able to say to the government, no, I don’t like that, or I want to name a different price. The government can effectively negotiate, force the hand of a defense industry to make something for them, a medical company. And in this situation, they don’t even have to sweat it.

using that extreme of a measure because they already have a patent on their process to do it and they’re gonna say to some company, make it, make it for us. so, the crazy world of patents. People talk a lot of smack but they don’t really have the background. So I welcome any questions, any comments on that. So bring your A game.

Psilo Toad (39:46.672)
Yeah, I find that to be really interesting. We will link that in the show notes in description for people for sure. But, yeah.

Psilo Toad (39:55.446)
Here’s the thing, okay? The patents, the money goes into the general fund, okay? And so it doesn’t go back into the patent office. So Congress loves it. So they’re gonna give patents to everybody for everything because most patents are never litigated. So everyone’s like, look at the cool patent I have. Like David Hildreth from Panacea Plant Sciences is like, look at the cool patent I have. It’s for everything. It’s…

religious use, it’s medical use, it’s everything, but good luck trying to enforce that patent. The minute tried to enforce that patent, guess what? The other side’s counter and it’s gonna be invalidated forever because it’s useless and it’s completely worthless. But still, the government took that person’s money. You feel me? So there’s all these patents, they’re only as good as their enforceability. So until they’re enforced or someone tries to invalidate them, nobody knows.

There’s a mismatch between what people think in the industry and what the values of the patents really are.

Psilo Toad (40:53.382)
What do you see?

Psilo Toad (40:58.8)
Based on what you read about the silamethoxin patent, what do you think about its potential enforceability?

Psilo Toad (41:07.491)
part of the patent that’s unique and protectable is the unique process. Right? No one who has a patent and mentions Psilomethoxin has a patent on the molecule because you cannot patent nature and cannot patent naturally occurring substances. Right? So you can’t do that. So these other people, have unique patents in effect that claim on those unique processes. That’s what they got. The transdermal delivery system.

Different ways to get them, yeast, bacteria, synthetic from plants and mushrooms, different ways to deliver them, transdermal, subcutaneous, oral, buccal up the butt, all these different formulations. And then other ways to figure out what’s a good fit for people, right? Or can you mix these two things together, stuff like that.

No one has then the patent for the specific molecule. And right now, there’s a patent that exists for psilomethoxcybin, the psilomethoxin prodrug, also called methoxy psilocybin, making that for bacteria. So there’s a patent that was granted this year, it’s to make, amongst lots of other tryptamines, psilomethoxcybin.

from bacteria.

Psilo Toad (42:38.908)
Interesting.

Psilo Toad (42:42.009)
So everybody’s pounding everything. Whether that’s going to ever sort out, that’s a different totally different.

Psilo Toad (42:48.486)
Yeah.

Psilo Toad (42:52.73)
Okay, Ben, is there anything you would like to leave people with for the day?

Psilo Toad (42:57.45)
Say again?

Psilo Toad (42:59.204)
upset Ben, there anything you would like to leave people with for the day?

Psilo Toad (43:02.379)
leave people with? shit. Yeah.

Rise against the machine, smoke weed, and take mushrooms.

That’s it.

Psilo Toad (43:14.837)
Amen brother, amen brother. Alright, peace out everybody, much love.

Psilo Toad (43:19.84)
It’s up.